Gardening Ideas

[ahoragi]

My plants have had some problems lately. One orange tree just "died", removing all leaves and creating a honey-like liquid on the spots the leave were attached to prior to falling.
Has anyone ever noticed that pot-plant's soil kind of "wears off" with time? It just does not look like normal soil anymore. I do add some fertiliser from time to time, but rarely. I assume it might be the microbial composition changing over time?

Soil doesn't last forever. You should add a layer of fresh compost or appropriate soil for the citrus tree every year. IIRC citrus trees like sandy well draining soil with organic matter.
I have a blueberry plant in a big pot and I add 3 inches of compost and acidic fertilizer every year to keep the soil functioning.

 

[Fake Sully]

Can you show me some photos of the orange tree? I could at least help rule out disease, although I have zero experience growing citrus.

I do have a fair amount of experience growing plants in containers at this point, and I've experimented with quite a few media mixes. My friends actually tease me because sometimes I find useful materials while hiking and I end up coming back with buckets of sand and rotten wood, etc. I've learned a lot from making my own soil mixes; plant nutrition and your soil mix aren't mutually exclusive (you could make it yourself and use fertilizers after, etc.), but things like drainage, pH and certain mineral nutrients (iron and magnesium especially) are strongly correlated to your media mix, at least before fertilizers.

I can't tell if you're describing a problem with the soil of a potted plant, but if you think there's a problem, telling me what kind of plant it is and showing me a photo of the pot/soil will help.

This is my (hopefully not) dying Orange tree. (2 photos ABOVE). The picture BELOW shows how another Orange tree looks like after having the same weird honey-like particles on it and loosing leaves.

I put some leaves of other plants in the same pot to make them grow roots (did not work yet). The tree is growing some new leaves after I cut all dry branches.


Below is my third, and biggest, Orange tree. It looks most healthy of the three. The dying and this one have been repotted around two weeks ago. I did not repot the already "dead" one. I cut dry branches from all of my citrus trees.


These two pictures show my pepper pants and their soil (first pot, for plants).


These two show the other four pepper plants and their soil (I often throw dead leaves on the soil after drying it or at least crunching it a bit into smaller pieces).


The pepper plants imo show the dry leaves because of too much "hard water" or "limewater" (Is that the correct name? I mean too much CaCO3 in the water).
According to the analysis of my city (and my cities specific group of regions) the pH-value is 7.7, the concentration of Nitrate (NO3-)28 mg/l. I hope this helps you with your evaluation.

 

[ahoragi]

Your pepper plants are in dire need of more growing space. That's too many plants in that small container. You can see the roots on top of the soil. They need their own pots with fresh soil. You can separate them by pulling all four out of the pot at the same time and use a garden hose to hose away the soil from the roots then lightly jiggle as you pull the plants apart. Try not to rip too many roots.

 

[Raiden]

This is my (hopefully not) dying Orange tree. (2 photos ABOVE). The picture BELOW shows how another Orange tree looks like after having the same weird honey-like particles on it and loosing leaves.

I put some leaves of other plants in the same pot to make them grow roots (did not work yet). The tree is growing some new leaves after I cut all dry branches.


Below is my third, and biggest, Orange tree. It looks most healthy of the three. The dying and this one have been repotted around two weeks ago. I did not repot the already "dead" one. I cut dry branches from all of my citrus trees.
These two pictures show my pepper pants and their soil (first pot, for plants).


These two show the other four pepper plants and their soil (I often throw dead leaves on the soil after drying it or at least crunching it a bit into smaller pieces).
View attachment 343View attachment 344

The pepper plants imo show the dry leaves because of too much "hard water" or "limewater" (Is that the correct name? I mean too much CaCO3 in the water).
According to the analysis of my city (and my cities specific group of regions) the pH-value is 7.7, the concentration of Nitrate (NO3-)28 mg/l. I hope this helps you with your evaluation.

Ahoragi is right; those pepper plants aren't happy, and part of the problem is lack of space. It's also true that many plants dislike higher levels of CaCO3 in their soil/water; there are plenty of exceptions, but most plants (by species/variety) prefer slightly acidic soil conditions. With that many plants of that size in the same container, none of them will get enough nutrients to grow.

I am not as experienced with growing food plants, but I have grown peppers successfully, and they require "full sun"; in general, this means a bare minimum of 6 hours of direct sunlight per day, and preferably more like 8 - 10 hours. If you're growing your pepper plants indoors, and you don't have a very bright, sunny window or artificial lighting, they'll have a hard time.

I'm sorry to say it, but there are likely three things wrong with your pepper plants; they need more space (i.e. bigger pots), an acid soil mix (may help offset the hard water) with more nutrients, and a lot more light.

As for the oranges; many citrus plants are difficult to grow in colder climates without a greenhouse. The citrus species/varieties grown for their fruits are subtropical in origin and cannot tolerate much in the way of frost. You can keep them indoors during the winter, but this can present problems as they grow larger; they may need artificial lighting, and they still need to be kept on the warmer side.

I did look up leaf loss on citrus plants, and it sounds like it can happen as a result of exposure to cold. What region do you live in, and what's the winter climate like? If it's really cold in the winter, your orange tree might be stressed by the cold, leading it to drop leaves.

 

[Fake Sully]

Ahoragi is right; those pepper plants aren't happy, and part of the problem is lack of space. It's also true that many plants dislike higher levels of CaCO3 in their soil/water; there are plenty of exceptions, but most plants (by species/variety) prefer slightly acidic soil conditions. With that many plants of that size in the same container, none of them will get enough nutrients to grow.

I am not as experienced with growing food plants, but I have grown peppers successfully, and they require "full sun"; in general, this means a bare minimum of 6 hours of direct sunlight per day, and preferably more like 8 - 10 hours. If you're growing your pepper plants indoors, and you don't have a very bright, sunny window or artificial lighting, they'll have a hard time.

I'm sorry to say it, but there are likely three things wrong with your pepper plants; they need more space (i.e. bigger pots), an acid soil mix (may help offset the hard water) with more nutrients, and a lot more light.

As for the oranges; many citrus plants are difficult to grow in colder climates without a greenhouse. The citrus species/varieties grown for their fruits are subtropical in origin and cannot tolerate much in the way of frost. You can keep them indoors during the winter, but this can present problems as they grow larger; they may need artificial lighting, and they still need to be kept on the warmer side.

I did look up leaf loss on citrus plants, and it sounds like it can happen as a result of exposure to cold. What region do you live in, and what's the winter climate like? If it's really cold in the winter, your orange tree might be stressed by the cold, leading it to drop leaves.

Tbh I do not care about the pepper plants that much, but next time ill only grow two of them in this container size, for the acidity I'll just play around with tab water and groundwater.

The citrus plants are much more important for me because they take FAAAR longer to grow. As I said, I repotted them, so currently space should not be a problem. They are growing indoors most time of the year (only not in ca. June-August) but they stand right next to many large windows (windows to their right AND left. It's the brightest spot in the house (from natural light) and I place other plants there once in a while when they show brown leaves too, so it's the best I can do. The problem might be, that during cold winter days, the area next to such large windows cools down a bit, but my lemon tree (not in the photos) and the big orange tree (in the photos) showed NO similar signs.

 

[Sopyu ftu äo]

I'm not very experienced with peppers, but the citrus soil looks quite compacted and not very well drained. Citrus like their soil to be have really good drainage, and do like surprisingly high humidity. I'd suggest refreshing the soil, and when you do, keep it light with plenty of sand/grit for drainage, and try and keep a bit of humidity around them (maybe a tray of damp pebbles underneath, or mist them morning and evening). Also, you do need to give them some tough love. They like a bit of cold in winter - not freezing them (that will def kill them), but they need a dormant period and constant room temperature heat and low humidity will mess with their natural growth/rest cycle. They need a seasonal contrast. Bring them down to 12-15c in winter to give them a little taste of the season. (drop the humidity when they are in low temperatures, otherwise they will be at risk from rot).

 

[Fake Sully]

I'm not very experienced with peppers, but the citrus soil looks quite compacted and not very well drained. Citrus like their soil to be have really good drainage, and do like surprisingly high humidity. I'd suggest refreshing the soil, and when you do, keep it light with plenty of sand/grit for drainage, and try and keep a bit of humidity around them (maybe a tray of damp pebbles underneath, or mist them morning and evening). Also, you do need to give them some tough love. They like a bit of cold in winter - not freezing them (that will def kill them), but they need a dormant period and constant room temperature heat and low humidity will mess with their natural growth/rest cycle. They need a seasonal contrast. Bring them down to 12-15c in winter to give them a little taste of the season. (drop the humidity when they are in low temperatures, otherwise they will be at risk from rot).

Hm, any idea how I can give them 12-15°C in the winter? Outside it's anywhere from -5 to +15 during the winter, so I cannot give them anything constant. Close to the windows is the best I can do.
I already repotted them a few days ago and I always add some special clay granules (idk if google translated that correctly here, those should be brown, porous little balls) at the bottom and I water them just once a week or even less but than fully, so no smaller amounts every day. I read that's not good for them

 

[Sopyu ftu äo]

Hm, any idea how I can give them 12-15°C in the winter? Outside it's anywhere from -5 to +15 during the winter, so I cannot give them anything constant. Close to the windows is the best I can do.
I already repotted them a few days ago and I always add some special clay granules (idk if google translated that correctly here, those should be brown, porous little balls) at the bottom and I water them just once a week or even less but than fully, so no smaller amounts every day. I read that's not good for them

No thoughts on how to cool/warm them sadly, as I've always kept mine outdoors - though I imagine a cool / unheated sunlounge or a gently heated greenhouse would probably do the trick?

For well drained soil you really want something mixed throughout the soil, not just in the bottom. What I tend to do is have a layer of true gravel in the bottom of a pot, then above them have a mixture of the soil type I want and rough sand or grit, "tossed" together in a big tray and mixed, as if you mixing together flour or something in the kitchen

There are synthetic "aerator" mixes you can buy to add to potting soil as well - perlite is a popular one that's pretty good, but I prefer gritty sand as I can get it for the low low price of free from the river beach. Whichever you use, I'd say a ratio of 4:1 soil mix to drainage material (grit or perlite) is good if your soil mix is naturally fairly well draining, and 3:1 if it isn't. Any soils with clays are bad for drainage. If in doubt, go for *more* drainage than you think you will need. You can always add more nutrients, but you can't easily add more drainage without disturbing the plants.

Your water regime sounds fine to me: Not too much water in general. Use more in summer / growing season, and very little in winter - and if they are outdoors, none at all in winter - the rain will be more than enough. Collect and use rainwater if you can, as it won't interfere with the mineral balance of the soil. Citrus like the soil to be slightly acidic - but don't overthink it or worry about it too much. Tap water and a slightly "off" soil Ph isn't end of the world stuff if the basics like drainage and decent natural light are in place. Again, if you have one, use the sun lounge, or even a good sized window that gets plenty of sun.

 

[tulkunbrother]

People here have a big range of topics they know about !
Friends, in the case of Fake Sully, do you think that worms would be an interesting addition to the bigger pots as a way to have a more "aired" soil? (Less compacted soil and with more oxigen I mean).

 

[Fake Sully]

People here have a big range of topics they know about !
Friends, in the case of Fake Sully, do you think that worms would be an interesting addition to the bigger pots as a way to have a more "aired" soil? (Less compacted soil and with more oxigen I mean).

Well, I guess worms would make the plant history rather than help
(Referring to the different topics: What threads would you want to see? I've been thinking about some kind of philosophical one (I mean, the "General Thoughts" one is already philisophical...)

 

[tulkunbrother]

Well, I guess worms would make the plant history rather than help
(Referring to the different topics: What threads would you want to see? I've been thinking about some kind of philosophical one (I mean, the "General Thoughts" one is already philisophical...)

Hahah yes, I know that in a yard, for example, where the plants are not in pots, worms are good, but in the pots I don't know!
About the threads, I am going trough some really busy weeks in work and at home, so I am not being able to contribute as I was doing before, but I would love to see more philosophical threads! I was thinking these days about Avatar and Animal Rights, I believe this would be a really hot topic here!

 

[Sopyu ftu äo]

Yeah def worms in small pots doesn't sound like something that will end well. They are great at aerating and enriching soil, but like any life they can only work with resources available to them.... They've got to get their food somehow, and in a confined environment that is definitely going to be the plants themselves sooner or later.

I'd definitely be interested to see some ideas about animal rights here too. It's always been a topic close to my heart, as has indigenous rights/treaties - something which is quite topical here at the moment (it always is - but white people recently decided to take notice again, as periodically happens).

 

[Sopyu ftu äo]

Hahah yes, I know that in a yard, for example, where the plants are not in pots, worms are good, but in the pots I don't know!
About the threads, I am going trough some really busy weeks in work and at home, so I am not being able to contribute as I was doing before, but I would love to see more philosophical threads! I was thinking these days about Avatar and Animal Rights, I believe this would be a really hot topic here!

I'm off to Ye Olde Englande tomorrow, so a month of no work (yay!) and naked trees (creepy). It's going to be weird, but nice to see some of the family over there.

 

[tulkunbrother]

Yeah def worms in small pots doesn't sound like something that will end well. They are great at aerating and enriching soil, but like any life they can only work with resources available to them.... They've got to get their food somehow, and in a confined environment that is definitely going to be the plants themselves sooner or later.

I'd definitely be interested to see some ideas about animal rights here too. It's always been a topic close to my heart, as has indigenous rights/treaties - something which is quite topical here at the moment (it always is - but white people recently decided to take notice again, as periodically happens).

I agree that the poor worms must have their proper space to live hahah a soil with not only worms but other insects and little animals is the best kind of soil to grow healthy plants!
If Fake Sully agree, let's make this new thread about animal rights and indigenous rights too! It is an interesting topic too, because there is no society that is so close to nature as the indigenous societies around the globe!

I'm off to Ye Olde Englande tomorrow, so a month of no work (yay!) and naked trees (creepy). It's going to be weird, but nice to see some of the family over there.

Wow, good trip, friend!

 

[Fake Sully]

I agree that the poor worms must have their proper space to live hahah a soil with not only worms but other insects and little animals is the best kind of soil to grow healthy plants!
If Fake Sully agree, let's make this new thread about animal rights and indigenous rights too! It is an interesting topic too, because there is no society that is so close to nature as the indigenous societies around the globe!

Wow, good trip, friend!

Yup, truly a topic I’d like to see here too! Naked trees are truly scary btw. Whenever I travel to a warmer country during European winter and come back home I am kinda depressed because the trees look dead

 

[ahoragi]

It is that time of the year!

 

[Fake Sully]

Oh no, the thing on my orange trees is getting worse.
Im gonna plant a whole area with plants just for bees this year (we have a word for that, we like to create words just by putting the together, its literally a bee-lawn). It's just gonna be very hard because the soil here is like concrete.

 

[ahoragi]

Oh no, the thing on my orange trees is getting worse.
Im gonna plant a whole area with plants just for bees this year (we have a word for that, we like to create words just by putting the together, its literally a bee-lawn). It's just gonna be very hard because the soil here is like concrete.

Go crazy with sunflowers. I use sunflowers to help bring the bees to my plants that need pollinated.

 

[Fake Sully]

Go crazy with sunflowers. I use sunflowers to help bring the bees to my plants that need pollinated.

They sell special mixtures for bees here.

 

[Sopyu ftu äo]

It's just gonna be very hard because the soil here is like concrete.

I feel ya... my yard is a mixture of wafer thin, degraded soil with the nutrient value of a McDonalds burger, and a load of sandstone. My plan is keep throwing seaweed and compost at it, and hope for the best...